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 Final 2 - The Duel

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Woody

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 1:24:18

You are wrong about me too.
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Dodger

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 2:49:40

Here are my guesses.

Those I'm reasonably sure about (which will make this more embarrassing if I'm wrong):

Queen Narissa - Misty
Boo - Pete? I could be totally wrong, but this should explain why I kept accidentally referring to Boo with masculine pronouns
Woody - Turner, but different people trying to seem like Turner have crossed my mind
Elsa - Emer

Those I'm sure to embarrass myself with:

Lady Tremaine - at different times I've thought John or Daniel, but Tom in incognito has also crossed my mind
Scott - at first I thought Rob, except he was active, so he couldn't be Rob.
Olaf - Duckbear??? Mets incognito has also crossed my mind
Pocahontas - Angel?????
Mulan - I thought Rachael until she was evicted, and now I have no clue.
John Smith - no idea
Kaa - no idea
Hopper - no idea
Gaston - my initial thought, and my longest impression, was DJMykee. More recently at different times, I've thought Justin, Tom incognito, Sam doing a great job of playing as a guy... I'm so confused. Laughing
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 10:04:50

Woody wrote:
You are wrong about me too.

Once again, I never said I was correct about you.
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 10:10:13

Lady - Mas bond? Quiet, mysterious. That's my final guess on that one.
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Lady Tremaine

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 10:41:58

Those guesses were very laugh worthy! thank you for the smile this morning, gentlemen.

Where are our hosts? Can we vote now?
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 10:57:18

LOL
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Elsa

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 13:34:46

Great final two I feel. Great job.

Dodger you were a challenge threat. But a fun ally.

Gaston you were up twice and made it here. Great work.
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 14:21:29

Thanks Elsa! Being on the block three times wasn't easy, but I always knew I'd make it through.
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Dodger

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 16:27:14

But??? Kidding. Thank you, Elsa. I appreciate it.
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Emma Swan

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 20:05:29

Guys, start wrapping it up. If you have any more burning questions, go ahead but voting will open tomorrow.
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Gretel

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 20:07:07

Omg I LOVEEEEEEEE this final 2!!!! Congratulations to you both!!! I am so sorry for missing all of the final moments of this game, but I've supported these two since the beginning so yay!!

Great season! You ALL did wonderful and hopefully had fun Smile
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Olaf

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 20:10:46

I am going to stay away from things burning...myself and fire do not mix unless we are talking firemen then I am in.
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 20:17:21

Are there no more questions?
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 20:19:52

Gretal! Hey beautiful! Thanks so much! Marry me!!
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Dodger

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 20:29:41

I appreciate the questions and comments so far, but I think Gaston and I would both like more questions. So if anyone has them, please ask. Thank you to everyone so far - it's truly appreciated.

Gretmel. <3
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Woody

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 21:03:31

Gaston what role did you have in my eviction?

Dodger did using the veto on me put are target on both of us?
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 21:28:47

Thanks Woody! Great question. I will answer this in a bit.
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Dodger

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Mon 20 Jun - 22:00:02

Hey, Woody! Thanks for the question! I told you I'd explain to you what happened at the end of the game...

Quote :
Dodger did using the veto on me put are target on both of us?

Yes, definitely. The first 2 veto winners kept the nominations the same, and everyone had been nominating people they saw as inactive. HOH #3 changed all of that, and me saving you raised a lot of eyebrows (see: Boo's comment and that whole fiasco).

It was a difficult decision, because I had just started talking to Gaston and didn't want to lose his trust so early, so I did talk to him about it. In some ways, maybe I shouldn't have used it - the odds are you would've stayed over Hopper. But if I didn't, even if you were safe, I could never expect you to trust me.

It definitely piqued the interest of Mulan, Pocahontas, and Boo. And whatever happened between you, Mulan, and Boo - Mulan is the only person who PM'd me to tell me about it, and only after I won HOH - further compounded it. I saved you with the POV, so you become a secondary target, and it would seem I was already the primary target. It was also the first time in the game that someone saved someone else, which looked suspicious. I knew it would, which is part of why I was reluctant to use the POV and took so long to make my decision (and why Gaston and I created a whole staged deal when he saved me, and why I started talking to Mulan more - to save ourselves from that). I wasn't trying to put a target on you, or on myself, at that point. But it happened, all the same.

Thankfully for me, others - Mulan included - had made a big deal about it, and used it as justification to target the person I saved (you), so I was able to flip that when it came time for Mulan to save Pocahontas, and use the same reasoning - that they had already established - to out them and at least one of their alliances. Unfortunately, you were evicted.

I don't think you were the primary target, and based on hearsay, originating with Pocahontas (and Pocahontas and Mulan both saying "people" saw me as a threat), the goal that HOH was to evict me. Mulan did mention you to me, and I hoped you had a close enough relationship with her that she wouldn't nominate you - even once you were nominated, you told me you thought they'd campaign to save you. I was PM'ing everyone, subtly suggesting they vote to save you, until Lady Tremaine called me out and said I was the only person she heard from suggesting Olaf (sorry, Olaf!). That's when I realized you'd be evicted; Mulan had already more or less told me why she nominated you, and Gaston had already told me Pocahontas said pretty much the same (that I was seen as a threat, and you were seen as being close to me).

So, yes. Strange as it sounds, me saving you is a big part of what made you a target and led to your eviction. I tried to win that HOH, and came close (the infamous false-win announcement), but failed. And from that series of events, you were nominated and evicted. Sad

I've heard rumors that for Mulan's HOH win, she got her answers from someone else. I'm curious to definitively figure out what happened there. That's still one blindspot for me, and might have something to do with your eviction. I have my suspicions, but I don't know for sure.
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 11:32:00

Woody wrote:
Gaston, what role did you have in my eviction?

Hi Woody,

I played a vital role in your eviction. For starters, I won the veto for that round and used it on Dodger. Not only did I want to take Dodger off the block (which I did), but I also wanted you up and out. You were a target of mine a few rounds prior to Mulan’s HOH and I did not get you out, because Dodger took you off the block during my reign. However, Dodger did ask me if I would be okay with him using it on you, and I told him yes. Weird right? Well, I did not want to come off as controlling, so I told him I would put the ball in his court. My rationale was that if you give someone (a potential ally at that time), an ultimatum… it only ruins and damages that relationship you have the chance to establish in the long run. So, I knew I would just adapt and figure out an alternative way to get you out, considering our history of nominating one another. One of the important things to remember in this game is to adapt and consistently come up with fresh ideas to use to your advantage. Sometimes things do not always go as planned, but that does not mean you give up on your goal… You just figure out another way.... And, my calm manner towards Dodger at that time, definitely aided in our relationship, I would say. I am not sure what he would have felt had I told him I did not want him to use the veto, because he really wanted to. Anyway, that decision was good for me, and I knew another opportunity to get you out would come knocking eventually and not to sweat about it…

Well, knock knock…. When I won veto during Mulan’s HOH, I knew this was my moment to take a stab at you. At that time, there was the looming possibility of the girls having an alliance, so I did not think that Mulan would nominate any of the girls as a replacement. I knew it would be very likely that she would nominate you, especially because Dodger saved you with the veto on my HOH. That was a bold choice he made, and it made people question what was going on between the two of you… So I used those suspicions to my advantage. Sure, it was a gamble, and it was possible that Mulan could have put up someone like Lady, etc. but I took that risk, weighed my odds and understood the very apparent possibility of you going up. I knew that once you were up, people would want you out because of your ties to Dodger. The girls wanted to do anything they could to cripple him, but what they did not realize is that the only thing that would cripple him, was getting rid of me. That round, Pocahontas was not thrilled that I used the veto on Dodger, so I had to do major damage control, put some chapstick on, and kiss some major BOOTY to most of the girls I had been working with. I had to do everything I could to assure Pocahontas, for example, that I had made the “biggest mistake of my life” and that I felt really “horrible” about taking Dodger out. I said that he manipulated me and was using me, but that was not the case whatsoever. I also had to talk with Mulan. Dodger mentioned this earlier in his answer, but we made a plan to send a series of fake messages highlighting that she was safe in the event Dodger won HOH. Mulan was unhappy with me, and we knew that was the only way she would ever attempt to work with me, and trust me again. I needed her trust, because I did not want to completely shatter any lines of communication I had with the girls, and Mulan was a huge person in this game to have trust you. Finally, I needed to talk to Elsa, someone I really respected in this game. I asked her for her help with this decision, and though I knew that I was taking D off the block no matter what, I told Elsa that I wanted her opinion on the subject, not only to gain favor and trust with her, but to establish a sense of “I need you here” mentality. She was a rational player, and I loved that, so I knew that she would be more than happy with me saving Dodger. When Elsa revealed to me that she thought it was a good idea, I was stoked, because it meant she would probably help blow some smoke out with the other girls (in the event she was in the girls alliance, double dipping between the girls and my alliance with her) and she would trust me in the long run for considering “her” idea. After doing the damage control, and positioning myself back into the middle (the girls on one side) and Dodger on the other, Pocahontas mentioned that she wanted Woody out because Olaf would be more useful for votes. That seemed like a solid excuse, but in the back of my mind, I always thought that the girls wanted to get rid of you, because of your ties to Dodger. This aligned exactly with what I wanted anyway. Had Pocahontas mentioned anything regarding getting rid of Olaf to me,I assure you, the result of that eviction and the votes to get you out would have still been the same, Woody. So, while I was not the only vote to get you out, if I did not take Dodger off of the block in the first place, you would have never gone on the block at all that round. Therefore, I played a rather large part in your eviction.

Thanks for the question.
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Pocahontas

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 15:37:03

I guess I'll ask, which one of you two wanted me gone more and why?

I've loved reading all the questions and comments. This is a great final two. Smile
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Gaston

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 19:34:52

Hi Pocahontas. Wow. Great question. I'm glad you asked, as I really wanted the chance to explain your nomination under my HOH to you.

To begin, I was going to say Dodger wanted you out more. It would make since considering, you were after him, and not coming for me. Before I explain my stance, however, I think it is important to clarify something. You are probably wondering why I went after you. Well, I wanted you out for two reasons. Not only were you really adamant about getting dodger out, (someone I wanted here for the long run), but I feel like you were so underrated, so good at this game, that it would be stupid and lethal for me to keep you around in the long run.

You were really great socially and even had a few people in your back pocket (even had a relationship with Olaf, which never occurred to me). I realized how good you were when you mentioned to me about dodger being a huge threat. I don't know if it was strategy, but you were really great at planting seeds here and there. Sometimes you had me so clouded, that I even questioned why I was ever aligned with Dodger in the first place haha. It was subtle, crafty, and everything I wanted to be socially. That's when I knew I needed to strike when the iron was hot. I put you and Mulan up together because I was very concerned that there was an alliance between the girls, one that you did not tell me about. One powerful alliance that would take a strike at my biggest ally. Also, being that you girls were saving each other left and right, it made me question where I was on your totem pole. After I put you on the block, it was apparent that I could not salvage any relationship with you. You were understanding, and really nice about the whole ordeal. It was weird. It seemed like strategy, a good one, because why would you tell the HOH you're upset with them? It was smart, but I knew it all too well. I do it all the time in games, so I figured your kindness actually meant I was on your BACK AT IT AGAIN list lol. Mulan on the other hand, reacted immediately. She was pissed, upset, but honest. That was the key there. Now don't get me wrong, Mulan was a fierce player, but I knew that I would have a better chance repairing the relationship I had with Mulan, as I believed 100% you did not trust me after that. It showed when you played nice.

There is a rule I live by in these games from my favorite book. It states that you must "hire former enemies, as they'll be more loyal." That's what I wanted to be with Mulan. I wanted to be the enemy she hired, because she thought I would be more loyal to her. Having you on the block and not going home would have been awful, but thankfully Dodger already wanted you out anyway. So while I do believe Dodger wanted you out really really really badly, I think I wanted you out just as much. You were a huge threat in the long run for both of our games, and I couldn't risk you being here.

I wish I would have been more honest with you about that, but I did not know if there was a buy back competition. That worried me, you coming back because, well.. You know what they say, Pocahontas... Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned. I sure as hell didn't want to get burned.

Thanks for the thought provoking question. It is much appreciated.
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Woody

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 20:26:29

Gaston what lies did you tell mulan to put me up? I talked to mulan just as much as dodger and I know she wasn't planning on putting me up.
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Elsa

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 20:40:55

I'm Dodger. Why vote me out? You said it was me voting Olaf but if that was fake why use that excuse? Also my vote wouldn't change it. Also we would of been the only two boring that round so Mulan would of went.

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Elsa

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 20:41:26

Ok Dodger *.
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Dodger

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PostSubject: Re: Final 2 - The Duel   Tue 21 Jun - 20:43:10

Hi, Pocahontas! Hey, I'm replying now. Laughing

Pocahontas wrote:
I guess I'll ask, which one of you two wanted me gone more and why?

I'm not entirely sure who wanted you gone more. I wanted you gone earlier, but no necessarily more.

There was an interesting parallel between you in this game, and someone in another game I've played. I'm not saying you're the same person, but it did force an association in my mind which may have clouded my judgment (but the clouded judgment paid off). Gaston is the only person who I really heard mention you, at least until I nominated you. Even once I figured out who talked TO you a lot, people very casually seemed to never really talk about you. People would talk about Mulan, but not you. Mulan herself became another exception once I nominated you, and I mentioned to her a bit of what I'd heard, to see who it would get back to, but for the most part she deflected attention from you, until she actually saved you.

Gaston mentioned that you were "BACK AT IT AGAIN talking" me, and mentioned you were upset about him taking me off the block, and - despite the deal he and I made - he seemed more concerned about you being upset than about Mulan being upset. I assume he would've saved me with the POV regardless, but it was obviously something he was weighing in his mind, about how to balance everything. And, despite Mulan nominating me, he seemed to be considering you just as much.

Initially, while you weren't one of the people I talked to most in the game, you definitely weren't one of the people I talked to the least, either. But you'd always say we didn't really talk. There could have been any number of reasons for that, of course. It could've been you truly just trying to talk, or you using me as a back-up to set someone else up, or you trying to set me up. Based on what I heard about me being your target, and the implicit suggestion of you saying we didn't really talk (meaning, you talked to others significantly more), I assumed the latter. There was a brief period when I was having fun with it - I think I wrote you a few moderately long messages, that I hoped would seem fairly transparent, and you would usually respond with a short line or two or text. For that brief period, it became a game to me - how long could I make my messages to you, and how short would be the messages I got back. <3 Sorry. Laughing Curiously, though I did talk to you more than some when you first said that, you saying that was one of the main reasons I began talking to everyone else more, and you truly did become the person I talked to the least.

I mentioned you to a few people, trying to probe, and - aside from Gaston and eventually Mulan, though Lady Tremaine and Narissa both mentioned you as part of the alliance - I never really heard much about you, but I did know you talked to people a fair amount. And in Big Brother, everyone mentions everyone, so when someone is rarely being mentioned, it becomes suspicious. Which kind of suggested you were a huge, hidden social threat, and one who I knew - initially thanks to Gaston - was directly targeting me. At least from HOH #4 onward, you were my main target. Lady, Queen, and especially Mulan became - at different points - secondary targets, but I also tried to maintain better relationships with them, as a way to indirectly get to you, and in Mulan's case, to see what would boomerang back to Gaston. I also mentioned you to others, just to fish for responses, but never really got what I was looking for. Everyone had to know you were my primary target, but it didn't seem like I quite had the support I wanted. Which explains the convoluted plan when I nominated you, to call out you and Mulan in front of *what I hoped* was your alliance. Mulan seemed to explicitly have everyone's trust, but something about your place in that was more eerie.

Eventually, I completely stopped talking to you - BECAUSE you were my primary target, and because I had connected the dots well enough to figure things out via other people. With nominating you, and Mulan saving you with the POV, I think I kind of called peoples' hands - enough people finally mentioned you, and I thought I might have the support. Talking to you more, because of my suspicions you were such a great social player, seemed like too much of a risk - if I slipped up once with you, I could undo all of the work I had done. I could have explicitly lied to you about everything in an attempt to deflect, but then I'd have to message everyone, "by the way, I told Pocahontas x, y, and z, and this is why I did it" so they'd know my rationale for saying what I did, in case some mutated version got back to them, and... It just sounded like too much of a mess, and too much of a risk.

So, you were my #1 target from the moment I heard I was your target, and you became an even bigger target to me in each stage of that process. Whether or not I wanted you out MORE than Gaston did, I don't know. Maybe not. But I did want you gone sooner, and it took a lot of work to make that a real possibility.

Thank you so much for the question! Crazy as it sounds, because I guess we really didn't talk, that situation with you - over a few rounds - really shaped my game, and I think ultimately solidified Gaston and me, albeit our eyebrows may have been raised for different reasons.
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Final 2 - The Duel
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